Schott 618hh. The good, the bad, and the ugly.

[RJD257]

I have a question for sizing on 618hh. Do I need to size up. In other schott model like 641 and 519 I wear size 36 .

Yes. Size Up. Take your ego out of it (lol), don't look at the numbers on the tag, and just go with what fits your torso the best.
* If you plan on wearing it in cold weather, and layering up, try it on with the thickest thing you would ever consider wearing.
* Realize that it will feel like plywood if you buy it brand new. The more you wear it, the more it will mold to your personal body.
* You may have to do some crazy **** to accelerate the break in process, but don't damage the jacket or the lining. In my case, I buried mine in the snow for a day, as well as pouring water over it another time - careful to never get the lining wet.
* You may have to "allow" or "forgive" if one area of the jacket is a bit "off." It's not a custom garment. In my case, I needed the volume in the chest & back, and have to forgive an extra couple inches in the waist (...which I can have tailored or just cinch with the belt...)
* Most of all ENJOY the JOURNEY !

 

[rain113]

I've ran it under cool water, It seems to make a little difference. The panels are less flat and more 3D if that makes sense.

 

[RJD257]

I've ran it under cool water, It seems to make a little difference. The panels are less flat and more 3D if that makes sense.

I literally buried mine in snow for a day as a way to get maximum moisture into the leather, but not damage the lining inside. That was after standing in the shower and having buckets of water poured over me and the jacket. The key is that the leather has to be moist enough to soften and be pliable, and then you have to wear it in that state so it molds to your body. Hey - no one said love of a Horsehide Jacket was an easy journey....

 

[Peter Mackin]

I agree that the Vanson is gorgeous and surely satisfies the cross-zip itch, but we know that never stopped anyone from wanting more. I've been on the lookout for a C2 (though probably not as urgently anymore now) but have never tried any Vansons out in person so I am not sure how they fit in comparison to the Perfectos.

Perfectos are very odd, the pattern seems to be pretty distinct so the measurements don't seem to be as illustrative of the fit as other patterns in my expereince. The 613Sh I would take a 44 but the regular new 618hh models the 44 feels too restrictive to pull off.

Never a truer word been said.Never go with the tag size.ive just taken delivery of a nearly new 613, size 46.the measurements seemed wrong from the seller but I took the chance.absolutely bang on everywhere. No chance a 44 or a 42 would have worked. The 23.5in back is perfect for my 5ft 9.its on a par with my 42 and 44 size Vansons. I can wear it with a tee shirt(loose) or layer comfortably. Will get far more use with this fit.

 

[RJD257]

Never a truer word been said.Never go with the tag size.ive just taken delivery of a nearly new 613, size 46.the measurements seemed wrong from the seller but I took the chance.absolutely bang on everywhere. No chance a 44 or a 42 would have worked. The 24.5in back is perfect for my 5ft 9.

Enjoy the Journey ! Now you just have to mold it to YOUR body !

 

[Peter Mackin]

Observations on the Schott 613 I picked up 4weeks ago.
Very comfortable jacket that doesn't go like board when it's cold.love the hide,no fake ageing and the construction is far superior to some vastly more expensive jackets I've owned, one well known makers jackets look like they have been sewn with knitting needles.
Used the 613 once on the bike and it worked well ,didn't ride up and sleeves a perfect length..although this jacket will be mostly off bike use.
Would only change 3 things to make better. Snap to secure belt buckle, 1.5inch taper at waist,and I find the sleeve lining is a quarter inch too long,need to tuck it up a bit after slipping into the jacket.
I had dismissed the perfecto for 50 years,buying everything else but,thankfully I've made up for it now..

 

[JackBroChill]

Observations on the Schott 613 I picked up 4weeks ago.
Very comfortable jacket that doesn't go like board when it's cold.love the hide,no fake ageing and the construction is far superior to some vastly more expensive jackets I've owned, one well known makers jackets look like they have been sewn with knitting needles.
Used the 613 once on the bike and it worked well ,didn't ride up and sleeves a perfect length..although this jacket will be mostly off bike use.
Would only change 3 things to make better. Snap to secure belt buckle, 1.5inch taper at waist,and I find the sleeve lining is a quarter inch too long,need to tuck it up a bit after slipping into the jacket.
I had dismissed the perfecto for 50 years,buying everything else but,thankfully I've made up for it now..

A beautiful triptych!

 

[Tom71]

A question to the Schott-enthusiasts:

I am trying to find out what the difference is between the 618 and the 613 models. Schott´s "compare with" mode is silent on that (I do note that the later has the One-Star epaulet, of course...).

 

[Manolito]

A question to the Schott-enthusiasts:

I am trying to find out what the difference is between the 618 and the 613 models. Schott´s "compare with" mode is silent on that (I do note that the later has the One-Star epaulet, of course...).

Are you asking for the horsehide (618hh and 613SH) or the steerhide (618 and 613) ?

 

[Tom71]

Are you asking for the horsehide (618hh and 613SH) or the steerhide (618 and 613) ?

The Steerhide ones.

Really just the non-specified versions. I am aware of how the 613S, 613SH or 618HH differ amongst themselves, but the plain 613/618 - no se…

 

[RJD257]

The Steerhide ones.

Really just the non-specified versions. I am aware of how the 613S, 613SH or 618HH differ amongst themselves, but the plain 613/618 - no se…

I'm going to let other expert contributors dive DEEP into the specific minutia, but the "short answer" is that they are different patterns, with different geometry, center back lengths (maybe even different sleeve lengths), shape of the kidney panels, etc....

 

[Manolito]

613 and 618 steerhides are the same pattern as far as I know and for all I've read and seen about them (including on the old official Schott forum). The differences are the stars on the shoulders, the fact that you can't put a removable collar on the 613 (so it has 3 less snaps around the collar), the snaps buttons of the 613 have no mention on them while the 618 have the schott nyc infos logo on them, the perfecto tag has the little bull drawing instead of the biker drawing. And i think that's all. The 613 just has a little more vintage vibe because of these slight differences.

 

[Tom71]

I'm going to let other expert contributors dive DEEP into the specific minutia, but the "short answer" is that they are different patterns, with different geometry, center back lengths (maybe even different sleeve lengths), shape of the kidney panels, etc....

Thank you.

You see, that´s exactly my issue :

Of yourse, I do assume, it must be different patterns. I just cannot track down the differences. Back lenght is listed as 25" each and all optical indicators of panel differentiation draw a blank.

 

[Tom71]

613 and 618 steerhides are the same pattern as far as I know and for all I've read and seen about them (including on the old official Schott forum). The differences are the stars on the shoulders, the fact that you can't put a removable collar on the 613 (so it has 3 less snaps around the collar), the snaps buttons of the 613 have no mention on them while the 618 have the schott nyc infos logo on them, the perfecto tag has the little bull drawing instead of the biker drawing. And i think that's all. The 613 just has a little more vintage vibe because of these slight differences.

Thanks much.

I am not much concerned about "design-features" like stars on epaulets or the odd addtional snap to fix an external collar.

I guess, I need to get over the notion that the numbering indicates pattern-specifics (as the 118 does with the dramatically different dimensions).
613S and 613SH seem to share some features (but once that are absent from the 613...), so I guess I am looking for some similarities to set the 613 apart from the 618.

You may very well be right, that there are none.

 

[RJD257]

613 and 618 steerhides are the same pattern as far as I know and for all I've read and seen about them (including on the old official Schott forum). The differences are the stars on the shoulders, the fact that you can't put a removable collar on the 613 (so it has 3 less snaps around the collar), the snaps buttons of the 613 have no mention on them while the 618 have the schott nyc infos logo on them, the perfecto tag has the little bull drawing instead of the biker drawing. And i think that's all. The 613 just has a little more vintage vibe because of these slight differenc

Thank you.

You see, that´s exactly my issue :

Of yourse, I do assume, it must be different patterns. I just cannot track down the differences. Back lenght is listed as 25" each and all optical indicators of panel differentiation draw a blank.

A couple of years ago (...when I joined the Fedora Lounge...) I was somewhere between fascinated & obsessed with the Horsehide jackets, so that's where I put 100% of my time, focus & intention, ordered both the 613SH and the 618HH, and they DID fit me personally a bit differently, but that may just be the Horsehide Models. IMHO, the 618HH retained more of the Durable Hero Cut, tapering down, and the 613SH was more of a "straight down" cut (...again, how it fit my individual body, two years ago, etc... your mileage may vary...)

It was exactly two years ago on Black Friday Weekend that I went into the NYC Retail Store, and tried on a bunch of different Perfectos - including the Brown Steerhide (...because I personally prefer Bronze hardware over chrome/silver...) If you are close to one of the three brick & mortar stores, that's what I'd recommend. If not, Jerri at Schott has been there for years, is a WEALTH of granular knowledge, and always generous with her time & experience. Give her a ring, and have an actual convo, rather than email. Of course, if you have the room to "float" two jackets on a credit card, you can always order one each, take advantage of the current 15% Black Friday Discount, and return one or both (...they are VERY gracious with their returns as well, just don't cut the tags off, wear it in the rain, etc...) Interested in hearing how this journey works out for you too !

 

[Tom71]

A couple of years ago (...when I joined the Fedora Lounge...) I was somewhere between fascinated & obsessed with the Horsehide jackets, so that's where I put 100% of my time, focus & intention, ordered both the 613SH and the 618HH, and they DID fit me personally a bit differently, but that may just be the Horsehide Models. IMHO, the 618HH retained more of the Durable Hero Cut, tapering down, and the 613SH was more of a "straight down" cut (...again, how it fit my individual body, two years ago, etc... your mileage may vary...)

It was exactly two years ago on Black Friday Weekend that I went into the NYC Retail Store, and tried on a bunch of different Perfectos - including the Brown Steerhide (...because I personally prefer Bronze hardware over chrome/silver...) If you are close to one of the three brick & mortar stores, that's what I'd recommend. If not, Jerri at Schott has been there for years, is a WEALTH of granular knowledge, and always generous with her time & experience. Give her a ring, and have an actual convo, rather than email. Of course, if you have the room to "float" two jackets on a credit card, you can always order one each, take advantage of the current 15% Black Friday Discount, and return one or both (...they are VERY gracious with their returns as well, just don't cut the tags off, wear it in the rain, etc...) Interested in hearing how this journey works out for you too !

Haha, brothers from different mothers, we are…!

I did but the 613SH three years ago and followed up with the 618HH three weeks ago when I was in NYC (I did a comparison thread with all measurement and personal fit impressions just in case you are interested).

The Steerhide versions had not been on my radar then, but I tried one on and was very impressed by the hide. I didn’t pay any attention to the model, but have since kept my eyes peeled for Steerhide Perfectos here on TFL.
Hence the new-found interest.

I have to say, my convos with the Schott people on Howard Street were a bit tedious. They were very friendly but evidently not keen on doing some nerdy deep-dive talks.

Jerri’s always a safe bet, I do agree. I just feel it would be trespassing to tap into her knowledge when I have zero intention of buying another Perfecto in the near future.

 

[Madhouse27]

We need someone to (please) go into the store and give us a side by side photo comparison of the standard issue “steerhide” 618 vs. 613 and also note any differences in the hide itself (if any).

I think I’ve now had 25 Perfectos come and go (well….some are still here) but strangely, I’ve never had a regular 613. For what seems like an mainstay item in the Schott catalog, they are a bit of a rare bird in the used market.

 

[Manolito]

I own a 618 40 and a 613 38 from around the same period (2015 - 2018) and frankly the leather seems very similar, although the 613 leather may seem slightly thicker on the sleeves. But nothing dealbreaking, more like a different batch to me. The look and the feel of the leather seems totaly similar. The pattern seems very alike to me, although there is one size of difference of course (back is shorter for instance).

 

[Peter Mackin]

Morning Tom,a quick note to say that my recently bought 613 in a size 46 has a back length of 23.5in- 24in .certainly not 25.when it came i though I wouldn't gel because of that.But it's becoming one of my favourite jackets. The steerhide is fantastic, heavy but feels soft and very substantial, dyed all way through. Its a completely standard 46(labeled)very very comfortable with me now at 185lbs.

 

[Tom71]

Morning Tom,a quick note to say that my recently bought 613 in a size 46 has a back length of 23.5in- 24in .certainly not 25.when it came i though I wouldn't gel because of that.But it's becoming one of my favourite jackets. The steerhide is fantastic, heavy but feels soft and very substantial, dyed all way through. It’a completely standard 46(labeled)very very comfortable with me now at 185lbs.

Thanks, Peter! I did read that earlier in the thread. I always assumed it must be an older run of the jacket, but I am basically guessing right now.

Both, the 613SH and the 618HH have a 25” back (SH 25,25) in size 44 but vary in the front.
The Shop Vancouver lists the 613 OneStar with a back of 25” as well in 44.

It‘s not a problem for me as I am more than happy with the new 618HH and certainly will hold back on another Perfecto for a while.

I seem to discover a new side in me that can’t accept that the numbering is perhaps NOT indicative of different patterns.